>>> HELLO EVERYONE AND WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR & CO." HERE IS WHAT IS COMING UP.

UKRAINE MINERAL DEAL, I ASKED THE CHAIR OF THE UKRAINIAN FOREIGN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE.

>> BEEN AN AMERICAN DOCTOR BACK FROM GAZA SHARES HIS EYEWITNESS ACCOUNTS OF THE ACCELERATED CATASTROPHE AND SLOW STARVATION UNDER THE SIEGE.

>> AND ISABEL ALLENDE 'S NEWEST NOVEL.

>> ALSO, OF THE UNIVERSITY'S RECKON WITH THE TRUMP WHITE HOUSE.

AND FREE-SPEECH MINEFIELDS ON CAMPUS.

>> "AMANPOUR & CO." ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT.

GYM ATWOOD.

>> THE SYLVIA A AND SIMON --, THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAILA AND MICKEY STRAUSS, MARK J -- SETON J MELVIN, THE PETER G PETERSON AND --FUND.

COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG.

WITH ROGERS.

CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATIONS FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU TO THE PROGRAM, I AM CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, IN LONDON.

CONTENT DAYS MINERAL DEAL BE A WIN-WIN?

SIGNING THE DEAL IN WASHINGTON AFTER CONTROVERSIAL LONG AND CONTENTIOUS PATIENT.

TODAY'S DEPORTED DEPARTURE OF NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR, DETAILS OF THE ENTERAL AGREEMENT CALLED THE UNITED STATES-UKRAINE RECONSTRUCTION FUNDS HAVE NOT BEEN MADE PUBLIC.

A RELEASE SAYS THE AGREEMENT WILL BENEFIT BOTH NATIONS, HIGHLIGHTING THE FULL CONTROL OF THE RESOURCES STAYING WITH UKRAINE.

BEAKING FOR THE U.S. SECRETARY --AND INVEST TOGETHER.

>> TODAY'S AGREEMENT SIGNALS CLEARLY TO RUSSIAN LEADERSHIP THAT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IS OMITTED TO A PEACE PROCESS CENTERED ON A FREE, SOVEREIGN AND PROSPEROUS UKRAINE OVER THE LONG-TERM.

IT IS TIME FOR THIS CRUEL AND SENSELESS WAR TO END.

THE KILLING MUST STOP.

BOTH THE UNITED STATES AND THE GOVERNMENT OF UKRAINE LOOK FORWARD TO QUICKLY OPERATIONALIZING THIS HISTORIC ECONOMIC PARTNERSHIP FOR BOTH THE UKRAINIAN AND AMERICAN PEOPLE.

>> THAT VIEW FROM WASHINGTON IS A HARD TURN FROM THE BITTER MEETING BETWEEN PRESIDENTS TRUMP AND ZELENSKY IN FEBRUARY.

MAYBE NOT AS INTENSE AS AT THE POPE'S FUNERAL, WHICH RANDALL EVANS HAD LED TO THE DEAL BEING SIGNED.

NEXT IT MUST BE RATIFIED BY THE UKRAINIAN PARLIAMENT.

WHERE OLEKSANDR MEREZHKO IS JOINING ME FROM KYIV.

WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.

GOOD EVENING.

CAN I ASK YOU FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE WILL YOU RATIFY THIS?

WILL HE GET TO PARLIAMENT?

>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL WE NEED TO CONSIDER THIS AGREEMENT IN THE COMMITTEE OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS, AS WELL AS OTHER COMMITTEES.

DEALING WITH THIS AGREEMENT IS COMMITTEE ON EUROPEAN INTEGRATION.

IT ALSO NEEDS TO TAKE SURE THERE IS NOTHING LIKE A HURDLE OR NO PATH TO JOINING THE EUROPEAN UNION.

AND THEN OUR COMMITTEE WILL VOTE IN A DEMOCRATIC WAY AND WE WILL RECOMMEND OR NOT RECOMMEND OUR PARLIAMENT TO SUPPORT THE CERTIFICATION.

>> YOU ARE BEING VERY DEMOCRATIC ABOUT THIS.

WE HAVE NOT SEEN THE FULL DEAL.

I WANT TO ASK YOU THEN, DO YOU SEE THIS AS CERTAINLY A LOT MORE IN UKRAINE'S FAVOR THAN THE ONE THAT WAS ORIGINALLY PROPOSED?

ZELENSKY DESCRIBES THE PREVIOUS ONE AS THE U.S.

ASKING HIM TO QUOTE, SELL MY COUNTRY.

DO YOU SEE THIS AS AN EQUAL PARTNERSHIP?

>> UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES WHEN WE ARE FIGHTING FOR OUR SURVIVAL, I THINK IT IS QUITE A FUROR DEAL.

COMPARED TO WHAT WE HAD IN THE BEGINNING --QUITE A FAIR DEAL.

THE FIRST DEAL WAS TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE TO US BUT LUCKILY WE HAVE SOMETHING MORE BALANCED, MORE BALANCED ALSO IN FAVOR OF UKRAINE.

I SEE IT AS A WIN-WIN, SORT OF A COMPROMISE.

>> AS I SIT INTRODUCING YOU, IT SAYS APPARENTLY ACCORDING TO WHAT HAS LEAKED FROM YOUR SIDE OR THE UKRAINE SIDE, YOUR COUNTRY WILL RETAIN EXCLUSIVE OWNERSHIP OF ITS NATURAL RESOURCES AND THE DEAL GIVES U.S.

PREFERENTIAL BUT NOT EXCLUSIVE RIGHTS TO MINERAL EXTRACTION.

WHERE ARE THESE MINERALS?

DO YOU THINK THEY CAN BE ACCESSED ANYTIME SOON?

>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL SOME OF THESE MINERALS, WE KNOW WHERE THEY ARE.

THEY CAN BE FOUND ON THE MAP.

WE HAVE SPECIAL STATE AGENCIES DEALING WITH THESE.

AT THE SAME TIME WE KNOW WE STILL NEED TO FIND OTHER KINDS EARTH MINERALS.

THE POINT IS, THEY CAN BE DEVELOPED ONLY WHEN RUSSIAN AGGRESSION AGAINST UKRAINE STOPS.

BECAUSE IN THE STATE OF WAR, IT IS EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO DEVELOP MINERAL RESOURCES OF UKRAINE.

ALSO, PARTLY AT LEAST, THESE MINERAL RESOURCES, NATURAL RESOURCES, THEY ARE LOCATED IN THE TEMPORARILY OCCUPIED TERRITORIES.

WHAT WE CAN SEE IS THIS MINERAL DEAL MIGHT SERVE AS A SORT OF INCENTIVE FOR THE UNITED STATES TO HELP US DE-OCCUPY OUR TERRITORY AND SUPPORT US, HELP US TO PROVIDE.

>> YOU MEAN ALSO TO PROVIDE WEAPONS AND OTHER ASSISTANCE THE U.S. HAS BEEN PROVIDING?

>> YES, ABSOLUTELY.

WELL, FOR EXAMPLE, DEFENSE SYSTEMS.

FOR US, WE NEED TO PROTECT OUR NEED AMERICAN AIR DEFENSE SYSTEMS LIKE PATRIOT SYSTEMS, AMERICAN MISSILES.

WE ALREADY HAVE A GOOD SIGN, PRESIDENT TRUMP AGREED TO SELL TO UKRAINE WEAPONRY FOR THE AMOUNT OF 50 MILLION U.S.

DOLLARS.

>> YOU SAID SELL TO UKRAINE.

WHAT IS INTERESTING IS PREVIOUSLY THEY WERE NOT SOLD TO UKRAINE.

I DON'T THINK.

BUT WHAT APPEARS TO HAVE HAPPENED IS THAT THIS DEAL NO LONGER TALKS ABOUT REPAYING THE UNITED STATES TO A MASSIVE SUM THAT IS NOT EVEN ACCURATE THAT TRUMP KEEPS BANDING AROUND.

BUT IT IS ABOUT FUTURE INVESTMENTS.

RIGHT?

NOT ABOUT REPAYING THE UNITED STATES.

>> EXACTLY.

AND FOR US IT IS A BIG VICTORY BECAUSE INITIALLY PRESIDENT TRUMP WAS TALKING ABOUT THE AIDE WHICH WAS PROVIDED BY THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION TO TURN INTO LOANS AND DEBT FOR UKRAINE.

WE MANAGED TO TURN THIS INTO INVESTMENTS, SO THESE PROFITS WILL GO TO SUPPORT OUR ECONOMY AND DEVELOP OUR ECONOMY.

FOR US IT IS DEFINITELY AN UPSIDE.

>> OF COURSE PRESIDENT ZELENSKY SAID WHY WOULD I FIND THIS?

THERE IS NOT EVEN, APART FROM THE EXTORTIONIST NATURE OF THE FIRST VERSION, THERE IS NOT EVEN SECURITY GUARANTEE.

THERE IS STILL NOT A SECURITY GUARANTEE BUT WE ARE SEEING SOME WOBBLES, MAYBE THERE WILL BE A SECURITY GUARANTEE ONCE THIS IS SIGNED, THE LATEST WE HAVE HEARD FROM TRUMP.

WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT THAT?

>> WHAT IT SEEMS IN TERMS OF SECURITY GUARANTEES, FOR US THE BEST SECURITY GUARANTEE IS OUR MEMBERSHIP IN NATO.

UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES, STANCE OF PRESIDENT TRUMP, I HOPE BY MAKING THIS DEAL WITH TRUMP, THE U.S., WE CAN COUNT ON MORE OF HIS SUPPORT, HE WILL BE MORE SUPPORTIVE.

FOR US, I WOULD SAY IT IS A POLITICAL AND PSYCHOLOGICAL GUARANTEE.

ADDITIONALLY, THE BEST KIND OF ECONOMIC GUARANTEE, THE BEST STIMULUS TO HELP, TO CONTRIBUTE TO SUPPORTING UKRAINE ARE OUR ECONOMIC INTERESTS OF AMERICAN COMPANIES WHICH WILL DEVELOP UKRAINE MINERAL AND STRATEGIC RESOURCES.

>> MR. MEREZHKO, YOU KNOW THAT WE KNOW THE POPULARITY OF THE UNITED STATES IN UKRAINE HAS PLUMMETED.

LIKE ROCK-BOTTOM.

AFTER THAT HORRENDOUS SITUATION IN THE OVAL OFFICE A COUPLE MONTHS AGO.

AND NOW PRESIDENT ZELENSKY SAID THAT WHAT HAPPENED IN THE VATICAN, A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ATMOSPHERE, COMPLETELY DIFFERENT CONVERSATION WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP, IS LARGELY FOR THIS DEAL BEING SIGNED.

WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THAT?

>> I DO NOT KNOW MUCH BUT I KNOW THE CONVERSATION BETWEEN BOTH THE PRESIDENT'S WAS 10 MINUTES AND TRULY A HISTORIC MOMENT.

IT WAS THE FIRST OF THEIR DIRECT DIALOGUE, DIRECT FACE-TO- FACE MEETING AFTER THE SITUATION IN THE OVAL OFFICE.

I HOPE IT WILL PAVE THE WAY FOR FURTHER MEETINGS BETWEEN BOTH PRESIDENTS.

THERE IS NOTHING LIKE DIRECT CONTACTS.

I UNDERSTAND TRUMP CAN USE INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS IN TERMS OF INTERPERSONAL RELATIONS.

THAT IS WHY IT IS IMPORTANT TO HAVE DIRECT DIALOGUE BETWEEN OUR PRESIDENTS.

>> AND LESLIE YOU MAY HAVE HURT THAT THE NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR, IN WAKE OF THE SIGNAL GAIT CATASTROPHE SCANDAL WILL POTENTIALLY BE LEAVING HIS POSITION.

HE IS MORE OF A TRADITIONAL TO PERSUADE THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, INCLUDING SANCTIONS, PENDING A CEASE- FIRE, WHICH IT HAS NOT YET.

WHAT IS YOUR ANALYSIS OR REACTION TO THE FACT THAT HE WON'T, MIGHT NOT BE THERE ANYMORE.

>> I HAVE PERSONALLY TREMENDOUS RESPECT FOR MICHAEL ALTS.

AND I BELIEVE HE MADE EXCELLENT SECURITY ADVISOR FOR THE PRESIDENT.

I KNOW PREVIOUSLY BEFORE HE JOINED A TEAM, AND ENTOURAGE OF PRESIDENT TRUMP, HE HAS BEEN CONSIDERED A FRIEND OF UKRAINE, IS UNDERSTANDING THE IMPORTANCE OF UKRAINE FOR THE UNITED STATES.

I WILL PERSONALLY REGRET IF HE LEAVES HIS POSITION, HIS OFFICE.

BUT I DON'T KNOW.

MAYBE WHO WILL BE THE NEXT NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR FOR THE PRESIDENT.

IT IS ALSO IMPORTANT FOR UKRAINE.

I REMAIN HOPEFUL.

>> ONE VERY SHORT QUESTION.

YOU CAN SEE SOME PRESSURE AND CHANGE OF TONE EMANATING FROM RUSSIA AGAINST, SORRY, FROM THE U.S. AGAINST RUSSIA.

DO YOU THINK IT WILL CAUSE PRESIDENT TO THINK CLEARLY AND MORE POSITIVELY ABOUT A CEASE- FIRE NOW?

>> THE ONLY WAY TO DEAL WITH HIS TO DEAL WITH PERSONAL PRESSURE.

TO PROVIDE UKRAINE WITH MORE MILITARY ASSISTANCE.

PUTIN IS NOT A PERSON WHOM ANYONE CAN MAKE A DEAL.

UNFORTUNATELY TRUMP, DESPITE HIS GENIUS OF DEALMAKING.

THE ONLY WAY TO DEAL WITH PUTIN IS TO JUST EXERT PRESSURE.

THAT IS ALL.

>> OLEKSANDR MEREZHKO, CHAIR OF THE UKRAINIAN FOREIGN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE IN THE UKRAINIAN PARLIAMENTARIAN.

>> THE ISRAELI SIEGE ON GAZA IS NEARING TWO MONTHS, DRIVING THE ENCLAVE TO THE MAN-MADE FAMINE.

THE WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION SAYS HOSPITALS ARE BEYOND DESCRIPTION.

ISRAEL INSISTS THAT BLOCKADE ON AID IS TO PRESSURE HAMAS INTO RELEASING HOSTAGES.

BUT INTERNATIONAL ORGANIZATION SAY THEY ARE VIOLATING LAW.

DR. SAMER ATTAR, AN AMERICAN SURGEON WHO RISKED HIS LIFE THIS PAST MONTH TO TREAT PATIENTS IN GAZA.

HE IS JOINING THE PROGRAM NOW, BACK IN HIS HOSPITAL.

WELCOME BACK TO THE PROGRAM.

>> THANK YOU.

>> NO WEST --NO REST FOR THE WEARY.

YOU HAVE COME BACK FROM GAZA TO IMMEDIATELY WORKING IN THE HOSPITAL.

I THINK THAT YOU ARE JOINING US ON YOUR LUNCH BREAK.

>> IT IS ALL GOOD.

I HAD A DAY OF REST, I ATE A LOT AND SLEPT A LOT AND SPENT A DAY OUTSIDE.

RECALIBRATED.

>> THIS COMING YOUR TRIP TO GAZA, WHAT YOU ENCOUNTERED MONTHS OF TOTAL SIEGE AND CONSTANT BOMBARDMENT.

WE HEAR MANY REPORTS, INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENCE CANNOT GET IN, WHAT IS IT LIKE FOR YOU TREATING, TRYING TO TREAT THE CIVILIANS?

>> THIS WAS MY SIXTH TIME AND IT IS WORSE EVERY TIME.

I MEAN I DON'T KNOW WHERE TO START.

MY FIRST NIGHT THEY HAD A BOMBING WERE 60 CIVILIANS WERE KILLED AND THEY HAD ABOUT 200 WOUNDED AND THE EMERGENCY ROOM IS OVERFLOWING WITH PATIENTS.

THERE ARE PATIENTS ON THE FLOOR.

THERE WAS AN 8-YEAR-OLD BOY WHO WAS GASPING WITH BLOOD, FOAMING FROM THE NOSE AND THE MOUTH.

AND THE NEXT TO HIM WAS A SIX- YEAR-OLD GIRL, HER HEAD WAS OPEN WITH HER BRAINS EXPOSED, HER INTESTINES WERE FALLING OUT OF HER BELLY.

THOSE ARE WHAT THEY CALL HOPELESS CASES, THEY ARE PUT ON THE FLOOR.

ALL I COULD DO WAS TELL THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS TO HOLD THEIR HANDS BECAUSE THEY WILL NOT MAKE IT, THEY WILL DIE.

WHEN YOU HAVE 50 MORE PEOPLE BEING ASSESSED IN TRIAGE, YOU HAVE TO ASSESS AND MOVE ON.

FOR THE LOCAL DOCTORS, THIS HAS HELD THEY HAVE BEEN LIVING FOR THE PAST 18 MONTHS AND THEY ARE REALLY GOOD AT IT.

THEY KNOW HOW TO SAVE LIVES BUT THE PSYCHOLOGICAL TORMENT OF SEEING --I REMEMBER A 10-YEAR- OLD GIRL WHOSE LEG WAS HANGING ON BY THREADS OF SPAGHETTI AND SHE UNDERWENT AN AMPUTATION OF HER LIKE.

IT NEVER GETS EASY.

>> NO, I AM SURE IT DOES NOT.

WE HAVE SEEN THE PICTURES YOU ARE SENDING AND WE WILL SHOW ANOTHER ONE NOW.

I WONDER IF YOU ARE NOTICING DIFFERENT KINDS OF INJURIES AND YOU KNOW, PEOPLE COME TO YOU TRYING --PRACTICALLY WITH VARIOUS DIFFERENT BITS OF THEIR BLOWUP BLOWN UP FAMILY MEMBERS.

WE HAVE A PICTURE THAT I WILL ASK YOU TO EXPLAIN.

IT IS A MAN, CARRYING THE PARTIAL REMAINS OF HIS DAUGHTER IN A BAG.

WE HAVE THE SOUND AS HE WAS DESCRIBING IT AND WE WILL TALK TO YOU ABOUT IT.

>> YESTERDAY WE WERE BAKING AND CHILDREN WERE AROUND ME BESIDE THE TOILET.

TWO MISSILES DROPPED ON THE BUILDING BESIDE.

TODAY I WENT TO LOOK AND FOUND HER UNDER THE RUBBLE.

MARRED AND TORN INTO PIECES.

DOGS TORN HER APART.

I FOUND THE HEAD, HAND, AND FOOT MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON HER.

>> DR. ATTAR, JUST, HOW DID YOU RESPOND?

HE CAME TO YOU.

JUST PHYSICALLY, INCREDIBLY TO WATCH A FATHER HOLD A DISCARDED A BAG FULL OF HIS CHILD.

>> YES, THAT WAS A TOUGH NIGHT.

THE NIGHT BEFORE WE HAD ABOUT 30 PEOPLE KILLED AND ABOUT 100 WOUNDED.

THEY SAID THERE WERE MANY MORE STILL BURIED UNDER THE RUBBLE.

WE WORKED 24 HOURS STRAIGHT.

IT HAPPENED MORE THAN ONCE AND YOU CAN BARELY STAND.

THAT WAS THE MORNING AND WE WERE HOPING THINGS WERE QUIET AND THINGS WERE QUITE.

THAT HE SHOWED UP AND LOOK NUMB AND I JUST THOUGHT HE NEEDED HELP, SOME DIRECTIONS.

BUT HE SAID HE WAS AT HOME AND THE BOMB LANDED IN HIS DAUGHTER WAS IN THE BATHROOM.

HE WENT BACK TO FIND HER REMAINS AND FOUND HER HEAD AND BITS AND PIECES OF HER ARM AND LEG.

HE PUT THEM IN THE BURLAP BAG AND BROUGHT HER TO THE HOSPITAL TO BE BURIED.

HE WAS LOOKING FOR DIRECTIONS TO THE MORGUE.

I WAS HORRIFIED, AGHAST OF WHAT I WAS SEEING.

FOR THE LOCALS, THEIR ATTITUDE IS THAT THIS IS GAZA AND WHAT WE SEE EVERY DAY.

REALLY NOT A BIG DEAL.

FOR ME, THE FACT THAT THOSE SORTS OF SCENES ARE NORMALIZED, I DO NOT THINK A HORROR MOVIE COULD FICTIONALIZE HOW THE TWISTED, AND DISTURBING.

>> YOU KNOW OF COURSE THE ISRAELIS CONTINUE TO INSIST THAT THEY ARE JUST LOOKING FOR HAMAS.

WE NOW HAVE HEARD FROM THE "THE WASHINGTON POST" REPORTING THAT THEY ARE SAYING THAT ISRAEL IS DRAMATICALLY ALTERING GAZA'S MAP, DECLARING ABOUT 70% OF THE ENCLAVE EITHER MILITARY ZONE OR UNDER EVACUATION ORDERS, PUSHING HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PALESTINIANS INTO WHAT APPEARS TO BE EVER DWINDLING TERRITORY.

WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE THAT?

HOW DID IT IMPACT THE CONDITIONS PEOPLE ARE UNDER?

>> YES, YOU SEE PEOPLE LIVING IN TENTS, AND THE RUBBLE OF THEIR HOMES.

THEY HAVE MOVED SIX, SEVEN, EIGHT TIMES AND MANY ARE LIVING OUT OF BAGS.

THEY HAVE VERY LITTLE IN THERE IS LITTLE FOOD AND VERY LITTLE WATER.

EVERY DAY IS A SCRAMBLE FOR THE HOSPITALS ARE THESE LITTLE OASES, ALMOST LIKE I GUESS YOU COULD CALL THEM PALACES IN THE MIDDLE OF THE APOCALYPTIC WASTELAND OF DUST AND RUBBLE.

THEY RUN ON GENERATOR SOMETIMES.

BUT EVEN THEY ARE RUNNING OUT OF SUPPLIES.

>> AND WHAT ABOUT A DAY IN THE LIFE OF THE HOSPITAL YOU WERE IN?

IT WAS STRUCK IN THE MIDDLE OF APRIL.

VARIOUS REPORTS SAY IT WAS THE LAST FULLY FUNCTIONING HOSPITAL.

JUST TELL ME ABOUT WHAT YOU HAD TO DO AFTER THAT, THAT'S RIGHT?

WHAT IS THE AMOUNT OF AID AND HOSPITAL CARE THAT STILL EXISTS IN GAZA?

>> THE HOSPITAL AT THAT TIME WAS THE MAIN TRAUMA HOSPITAL FOR GAZA CITY.

THAT IS WHERE I WAS BASED IN WORKING WITH LOCAL SURGEONS.

IT WAS THE HOSPITAL THAT SAVED LIVES.

THE EMERGENCY DOCTORS THERE KNEW HOW TO TRIAGE AND PERFORM LIFE-SAVING PROCEDURES.

THEY KNEW HOW TO GET TO PEOPLE TO THE OPERATING ROOM QUICKLY AND WHO WOULD NOT MAKE IT.

THE FIRST NIGHT I WAS THERE I WAS WOKEN UP BY A NURSE TO A SCREAMING AT ME TO RUN.

THERE WAS MISINFORMATION THAT THE ARMY WAS INVADING AND THEY WOULD BOMB THE HOSPITAL.

WHEN I CAME DOWNSTAIRS THERE WAS ABOUT 40 TO 50 PATIENTS, A LOT OF THEM ARE LITTLE KIDS WITH AMPUTATIONS, BROKEN BONES, THEY ARE WITH THEIR FAMILY.

ABOUT 100 PEOPLE LEFT IN THE BUILDING.

ME AND A HANDFUL OF NURSES, WE DECIDED WE DID NOT KNOW WHAT WAS HAPPENING BUT WE DECIDED WE WOULD STAY WITH THEM.

BECAUSE IF THE HOSPITAL WAS GOING TO GET BOMBED WE DECIDED WE WOULD DIE WITH OUR PATIENTS, TAKING CARE OF THEM AND NOT WANTING AWAY FROM THEM.

--RUNNING AWAY FROM THEM.

THE HOSPITAL DID GET HIT AND WE ALL THOUGHT WE WOULD BE BURIED ALIVE IN THE BUILDING, BUT ALL WE FELT WERE THE REVERBERATIONS AND THE SHOCKWAVES OF THE BUILDING HIT NEXT US.

WHEN THAT HAPPENED, FOR ABOUT SEVEN HOURS WE WERE CUT OFF AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WAS GOING ON.

DAYLIGHT CAME AND WE SAW THE STAFF TRICKLING BACK INTO THE HOSPITAL.

THE HOSPITAL WAS OUT OF SERVICE, AND THE FACT WE COULD NOT TAKE CARE OF ANYBODY THAT WAS INJURED.

THEY WERE BRINGING PEOPLE IN OFF THE STREETS BUT BECAUSE WE HAD NO ER DEPARTMENT, THE PEOPLE THAT COULD BE SAVED WERE PACKED INTO AMBULANCES AND DRIVEN TO ANOTHER HOSPITAL ABOUT TWO MILES AWAY.

AS OF NOW WE ARE STILL TRYING TO PICK UP THE PIECES.

ALL THEY ARE DOING IS TAKING CARE OF THE PATIENTS CURRENTLY THERE.

THE HOSPITAL HAS NO CAPACITY TO TAKE CARE OF ACUTE INJURIES.

>> WE HAVE PICTURES OF YOU THERE DOING, DRILLING A PIN INTO A GENTLEMAN'S ARM.

THEN THERE IS A PICTURE OF YOU PLACING A PEDIATRIC CHEST TUBE, NOT IN THE WHEELHOUSE OF THE SURGEON THAT YOU ARE, BUT IN GAZA ANYTHING GOES.

IS A NEW MEDICINE IS COMING IN, NO FOOD, NO WATER.

WHAT IS THE ACTUAL CONDITIONS AS THE INTERNATIONAL AID AGENCIES, THE U.N.-BASED AGENCIES SAY THEY ARE RUNNING OUT OF EVERYTHING.

THEY ARE RATIONING, RUNNING OUT.

THE VIDEO OF ME PUTTING IN THE PEN, I AM NOT WEARING A SURGICAL GOWN AND THERE ARE NO DRAPES, I AM WEARING GLOVES AND DRILLING A PIN INTO A MAN'S PHONE.

THAT IS NOT IDEAL.

BUT THEY ARE RUNNING OUT OF STUFF AND THE NEED TO PRESERVE FOR WHEN THEY THINK THEY ACTUALLY NEED IT.

THEIR CONCERN IS THEY WILL GET TO ZERO AND THEN HAVE NO MORE OF IT.

AS A DOCTOR, AN AMERICAN DOCTOR, WE ARE NOT THE MAIN CHARACTERS BUT JUST THE SUPPORTING ACTORS THAT ARE THERE TO HELP AND ASSIST THE LOCALS.

THE LOCALS ARE SAYING THAT THEY DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH AND THEY ARE RUNNING OUT, PRETTY MUCH RUNNING ON FUMES AND USING WHAT LITTLE THEY HAVE.

IT IS NOT IDEAL TO DO AN ORTHOPEDIC SURGERY WITH NO GOWNS AND NO SURGICAL DRAPES.

IT IS NOT IDEAL WHEN YOU HAVE AN ORTHOPEDIC SURGEON PUTTING IN A PEDIATRIC CHEST TUBE AND WHEN YOU HAVE 50 PEOPLE AND TRYING TO HELP AS MANY AS YOU CAN, PEOPLE CHIP IN WHEREVER THEY CAN.

>> I WONDER WHAT, AFTER ALL THESE TRIPS, THE EMOTIONAL TOLL IS FOR YOU?

AND WHETHER YOU COME BACK AND YOU BRING THESE STORIES AND YOUR PICTURES TO YOUR ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES, YOUR CONGRESSPEOPLE, YOUR SENATORS.

I DON'T KNOW, WHAT ANSWER DO YOU GET.

OR EVEN TO THE ISRAELI AUTHORITIES ON YOUR WAY OUT.

>> ALL I CAN DO IS SAY WHAT I AM SEEING.

IT IS A SMALL, SMALL WORLD AND NONE OF A STANDALONE.

THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE IN A LOT OF PAIN.

AND IF ALL IT MEANS FOR ME IS TO SHOW UP AND BE A DOCTOR AND TO BEAR WITNESS TO SUFFERING AND TELL PEOPLE WHAT I AM SEEING, IF THAT LEAVES ONE SMALL BREAK TOWARDS THE FOUNDATION OF PEACE AND HEALING, TO ME THAT IS PRETTY MUCH ALL I >> IT IS IMPORTANT.

DO YOU INTEND TO GO BACK?

>> I HOPE SO.

LIKE I SAID, IF GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY AND PRIVILEGE TO HELP AND MAKE A DIFFERENCE, I THINK ANYONE WOULD DO IT.

>> MAYBE NOT ANYBODY BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF PHENOMENALLY DEDICATED DOCTORS AND HUMANITARIANS LIKE YOURSELF.

THANK GOD FOR THAT.

DR. ATTAR, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US FOR YOUR HOSPITAL IN CHICAGO WHERE I GUESS YOU'RE GOING BACK ON SHIFT AGAIN ANY MINUTE NOW.

>> YES, NORTHWESTERN, THEN BACK TO CLINIC.

THANK YOU FOR MAKING TIME.

>> THANK YOU FOR MAKING TIME.

>>> NOW THE BLESSED NOVELIST ISABEL ALLENDE HAS A NEW BOOK OUT, MY NAME IS --AND IT TELLS THE STORY OF CIVIL WAR FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF A FEMALE WAR CORRESPONDENT FORCED TO WRITE UNDER A MALE PENDING.

SHE HERSELF FLED FROM THE 1973 COUP.

SHE BRINGS --WELCOME BACK TO OUR PROGRAM.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> YOU KNOW THIS ONE IS MAKING WAVES AGAIN.

IS YOUR 20th BOOK.

WE HAVE TO SAY THAT YOU HAVE WRITTEN AND SOLD, YOU HAVE SOLD MORE THAN 80 MILLION BOOKS AROUND THE WORLD.

THIS ONE FOLLOWS --AND HER JOURNEY FROM PULP FICTION NOVELIST TO WARTIME CORRESPONDENT.

WHAT INSPIRED YOUR LATEST WORK?

>> THE CIVIL WAR IN CHILE THAT I WAS ALWAYS INTERESTED IN THAT EVENT.

IT ECHOES TO WHAT HAPPENED IN 1973.

IN BOTH CASES THERE WAS A PROGRESSIVE VISIONARY PRESIDENT WHO WANTED REALLY IMPORTANT FACED BRUTAL OPPOSITION FROM THE CONSERVATIVES, AND THERE WERE FORCES THAT INTERVENE.

THE NAVY WHAT WITH THE OPPOSITION AND THE ARMY WITH THE PRESIDENT AND WE HAD A LUDY, A HORRIBLE CIVIL WAR IN WHICH MORE CHILEANS DIED IN FOUR MONTHS THAN THE FOUR MONTHS IN THE WAR AGAINST PERU AND BOLIVIA.

IN 1973 WE ALSO HAD A PROGRESSIVE PRESIDENT THAT WANTED TO MAKE CHANGES, FACE THE OPPOSITION.

AND WE HAD THE MILITARY COUP.

THE MILITARY DID NOT SPLIT, SO THEY WERE ALL UNITED FORCE AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT.

AND IN BOTH INSTANCES THE PRESIDENT COMMITTED SUICIDE.

>> REALLY DRAMATIC.

AND OF COURSE 1973, A RELATIVES, A RELATIVE OF YOURS, COUSIN OF YOUR FATHER I BELIEVE.

JUST A POINT THAT OUT.

CHARACTER, I GUESS IT MIGHT BE AN OBVIOUS QUESTION BECAUSE YOU ARE A JOURNALIST BUT WHY FEATURE A WAR CORRESPONDENT IN THIS NOVEL.

AND ALSO SHE HAD TO WRITE AS A MAN!

>> IN THE BEGINNING SHE DID BECAUSE WOMEN DID NOT HAVE A PLACE IN THE PRESS AT THE TIME.

THERE WERE VERY FEW WOMEN JOURNALISTS.

THEY WOULD WRITE PIECES OF OPINION, CHRONICLE, SOCIAL EVENTS.

BUT I WANTED A NEW SIDE, NOT OTHER SIDE OF THE CONFLICT.

BECAUSE THE AMERICANS WERE INVOLVED IN THE WAR, AS IT HAPPENED IN 1973 AS WELL, AND I THOUGHT WELL, IT WOULD BE AN AMERICAN JOURNALIST, WAR CORRESPONDENT.

BUT I LOVE TO WRITE ABOUT WOMEN.

SO I THOUGHT, WHY WOULD THEY SEND A WOMAN TO COVER THE WAR?

OKAY, SHE SPEAKS SPANISH, SHE HAS CHILEAN ROOTS.

OTHER, IT ALLOWED ME TO BUILD UP THIS CHARACTER THAT IS UNUSUAL, BUT NOT THE UNIQUE CASE AT THAT TIME.

>> SO YOU HAVE CHOSEN AN EXTRACT TO READ FROM THE OPENING OF THE BOOK.

IF YOU WOULD NOT MIND READING IT.

>> YES, THIS IS BETWEEN, THIS IS WHEN EMILIA DEL VALLE IS A CHILD, SEVEN YEARS OLD.

>> WHILE WE ARE HERE, LET'S GO SEE THE HEAD OF --MY MOTHER SAID.

WE PAY BE ENTRANCE FEE AND WE WALKED THE LONG HALLWAY TO THE REAR.

ENTERED A ROOM WITH CANDLES LIKE CHURCH.

ON A TABLE SHROUDED IN BLACK CLOTH SET TWO LARGE GLASS JARS.

I WAS PARALYZED BY FREIGHT.

THE FIRST JAR HELD A HUMAN HAND FLOATING IN A YELLOWISH LIQUID.

THE SECOND, A MAN'S DECAPITATED HEAD WITH THE EYELIDS SEWN SHUT, LIPS PULLED BACK AND HAIR STANDING ON END.

JOAQUIN WAS A CHILEAN BANDIT, LIKE YOUR FATHER.

THIS IS HOW BANDITS USUALLY END UP MY MOTHER EXPLAINED.

>> THERE ARE SO MANY LAYERS THERE THAT I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT.

FIRST OF ALL WHY OPEN LIKE THAT?

IT IS PRETTY SCARY AND GROTESQUE.

>> WELL, THIS SETS THE TONE FOR THE REST OF THE BOOK.

AND EMILIA IS THE ILLEGITIMATE CHILD OF A CHILEAN ARISTOCRAT THAT WAS PASSING BY SAN FRANCISCO, SO SHE HAS A BIOLOGICAL FATHER SHE HAS NEVER MET THAT LIVES IN CHILE.

WHEN SHE GOES TO CHILE TO COVER THE WAR, PART OF HER MISSION FOR HER FAMILY, IS TO FIND THIS MAN AND RECONNECT TO HIM.

>> THERE ARE SOME LAYERS OF PERSONAL EXPERIENCE BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR FATHER.

I WILL GET THAT ANY MOMENT.

I WANT TO KNOW BECAUSE SOME OF MY TEAM WAS SAYING THERE IS SORT OF A DARK TWIST AND HOW YOU DESCRIBE THE TOUR OF THESE BODY PARTS, THE SON IS TAKEN BY HIS FATHER TO SEE I.C.E.

DID THAT OCCUR TO YOU?

IS THAT A TRIBUTE?

>> NO!

NOT AT ALL.

IT IS A LINK TO ANOTHER BOOK THAT I WROTE YEARS AGO CALLED "DAUGHTER OF FORTUNE.

YOU CAN IN WHICH THE PROTAGONIST IS LOOKING FOR HER LOVER WHO IS CALLED WALKING.

SHE ENDS UP STARING AT THE HEAD OF JOAQUIN IN A JAR.

IT IS A CONNECTION TO THAT.

>> WE HAVE PUT AWAY SORT OF THAT INSPIRATIONAL NON- INSPIRATION.

LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE NOVEL.

IT IS WRITTEN IN THE FIRST PERSON.

IT IS, YOU KNOW, IT SPANS YOUR CURRENT, WHERE YOU CURRENTLY LIVE IN CALIFORNIA ALL THE WAY TO CHILE.

AND IT HAS LAYERS OF PARENTAL RELATIONSHIP THAT QUITE HOW PERSONAL WAS IT FOR YOU?

>> MANY PEOPLE WHO HAVE READ THE BOOK, OR THE FEW PEOPLE WHO HAVE READ IT, HAVE POINTED OUT THAT EMILIA IS MY ALTER EGO.

SHE IS NOT.

I WAS THINKING ABOUT, I WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT THAT AT ALL.

BUT WE DRAW FROM MEMORY, FROM EXPERIENCE, THE THINGS WE CARE ABOUT.

SO NO WONDER BETWEEN THE LINES THE AUTHOR IS ALWAYS THERE.

>> BUT I MEAN YOU HAVE A PRETTY DRAMATIC RELATIONSHIP OR NOT RELATIONSHIP WITH HER OWN FATHER IN REAL LIFE.

THOMAS WAS HIS NAME AND HE LEFT YOUR FAMILY WHEN YOU WERE JUST A TODDLER.

HONESTLY, IT IS AN EXTRAORDINARY THING TO ASK YOU HOW YOU FIRST CAME UPON HIM.

IT WAS AFTER HE DIED.

>> YES, HE DIED IN THE STREET OF A HEART ATTACK AND THEY CALLED ME TO IDENTIFY THE BODY.

BUT I HAD A TD PROGRAM SORT OF NEWLY BEEN AND I COULD NOT IDENTIFY THIS BODY BECAUSE I HAD NEVER SEEN A PICTURE OF MY FATHER.

MY MOTHER HAD DESTROYED ALL OF THE PHOTOGRAPHS, ANYTHING RELATED TO HIM.

BUT THEN MY STEPFATHER CAME AND SAID THAT IS YOUR FATHER.

TAKE A LOOK AT HIM.

AND TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH, I DID NOT FEEL ANY PARTICULAR EMOTION OR CONNECTION.

NOTHING.

JUST THE SURPRISE OF SEEING A DEAD PERSON FOR THE FIRST TIME.

>> IT IS AN AMAZING STORY.

BUT JUST TO PICK UP, WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE, YOU FOCUS VERY MUCH ON WOMEN, WOMEN WHO DO NOT NECESSARILY FOLLOW CONVENTIONAL LAWS, WOMEN ALWAYS AHEAD OF THEIR TIME.

TELL ME ABOUT HOW YOU CHOSE TO PORTRAY THE WOMEN IN THIS BOOK.

AND, DO YOU FEEL YOU STILL HAVE TO KEEP DOING THAT IN GIVING WOMEN'S PLACE IN THE WORLD TODAY.

>> OF COURSE.

BUT IT IS NOT AN INTENTIONAL WAY TO DELIVER A MESSAGE.

NOT AT ALL.

WHEN I WRITE FICTION I WANT TO TELL A STORY AND ENGAGE MY READER IN THAT STORY.

THERE IS NO MESSAGE.

NEW PREACHING.

BUT I WRITE ABOUT WHAT I LIKE, WHAT I CARE, WHAT INTERESTS ME.

THAT IS WOMEN'S LIVES.

I AM SURROUNDED BY STRONG WOMEN.

I HAVE A FOUNDATION THAT WORKS MOSTLY WITH WOMEN.

MANY OF THEM ARE REFUGEES.

WOMEN WHO HAVE LOST EVERYTHING.

THAT HAVE GONE THROUGH --AND THEY ARE VICTIMS.

THEY GET UP ON THEIR FEET AND THEY TAKE HOLD OF THEIR OWN DESTINIES.

AND THAT IS SO FASCINATING TO ME.

BUT THAT IS WHAT I TEND TO WRITE ABOUT.

>> AND TO BRING IT BACK TO TODAY, YOU LIVE IN THE UNITED STATES, CALIFORNIA, NOT FAR FROM THE MEXICAN BORDER.

YOU HAVE SEEN WHAT IS HAPPENED >> MY FOUNDATION.

MY FOUNDATION WORKS THERE.

I AM TERRIFIED OF WHAT IS GOING ON, HORRIFIED OF WHAT IS GOING ON.

THIS IS NOTHING NEW.

THIS HAS BEEN HAPPENING FOR SEVERAL ADMINISTRATIONS ALREADY.

AND I WROTE A BOOK CALLED " THE WIND KNOWS MY NAME."

IT IS THE CASE OF A LITTLE BLIND GIRL SEPARATED FROM HER MOTHER AT THE BORDER DURING THE FIRST TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, WHEN THERE WAS A POLICY OF SEPARATING FAMILIES.

AND I MET HER THROUGH MY FOUNDATION.

SO IT WAS JUST NATURAL TO TELL HER STORY BECAUSE I SEE THE STORIES ALL THE TIME.

AND IT IS VERY HARD.

I MEAN IT IS HARD FOR PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT IT MEANS TO LEAVE EVERYTHING BEHIND.

INCLUDING SOMETIMES YOUR FAMILY.

AND GO TO ANOTHER PLACE OR YOU WILL NOT BE WELCOMED, TO TRY TO FIND SAFETY AND ANOTHER LIFE.

AND THERE ARE 117 MILLION REFUGEES IN THE WORLD, 80% OF THEM ARE WOMEN AND CHILDREN.

THEY ARE LOOKING FOR SAFETY, JUST THAT.

LOOK AT WHAT WE JUST HEARD ABOUT EMILIA, ABOUT GAZA.

ANY PARENT WOULD LIKE TO GET OUT OF THERE AND SAVE THEIR CHILDREN.

AT LEAST.

SO IT IS VERY HARD TO UNDERSTAND FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT BEEN DISPLACED AND IT IS HARD TO HAVE COMPASSION.

>> IT IS TRAGIC, WHAT WE ARE SEEING OLIVER THE WORLD.

I WANT TO TAKE YOU BACK TO YOUR INITIAL PROFESSIONAL CAREER WERE YOU WORRIED JOURNALIST.

IS IT TRUE YOU WENT TO MEET THE GREAT CHILEAN POET AND NOBEL PRIZE WINNER PABLO NERUDA, WHO TOLD YOU TO CHANGE CAREERS?

>> YES, IT IS TRUE.

UNFORTUNATELY.

I DID NOT PAY ATTENTION.

I SHOULD HAVE.

THAT WAS 1973, A COUPLE OF MONTHS BEFORE THE MILITARY COUP.

AND THEN NERUDA DIED AFTER THE COUP.

I DID NOT REMEMBER HIS WORDS UNTIL MANY YEARS LATER WHEN I FINALLY WROTE MY FIRST NOVEL, "LIVING IN EXILE IN VENEZUELA."

AND HE TOLD ME THAT I WAS A LOUSY JOURNALIST!

THAT I WOULD PUT MYSELF IN THE MIDDLE OF EVERYTHING.

I COULD NOT BE OBJECTIVE.

IF I DID NOT HAVE A STORY THAN I PROBABLY MADE IT UP.

SO HE SAID SWITCH TO LITERATURE WERE ALL OF THESE DEFECTS ARE VIRTUES.

>> THAT WAS REALLY GOOD ADVICE BUT WERE YOU CRUSHED, WOUNDED?

>> AT THE TIME, OF COURSE.

BUT THEN I FORGOT ABOUT IT BECAUSE LIFE TOOK OVER.

YOU KNOW?

WE HAVE THE COUP AND EVERYTHING CHANGED.

>> ISABEL ALLENDE, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

>>> WE TURNOUT ACADEMIA IN THE UNITED STATES WHERE ELITE PRESSURE FROM THE WHITE HOUSE.

SOME ANYWAY.

IT COMES AS PRESIDENT TRUMP SUGGEST HE MAY STOP GIVING GRANTS TO HARVARD UNIVERSITY AS THEY PUSH BACK ON HIS ESCALATING DEMANDS.

WHAT IS THE DEMAND OF THEIR PUSHBACK?

IN AN EXCLUSIVE FOR THE "THE WALL STREET JOURNAL" DOUGLAS BELKIN DISCUSSES JUST THAT.

HERE IS MORE.

>> THANK YOU.

YOU WROTE A PIECE IN THE JOURNAL THIS WEEK THAT WAS TITLED ELITE UNIVERSITIES PROVIDE PRIVATE COLLECTIVE TO --TRUMP ADMINISTRATION.

WHO ARE THE UNIVERSITIES?

HOW MANY ARE THERE?

>> THERE'S ABOUT 10 UNIVERSITIES, MOST ARE PRIVATE SCHOOLS IN BLUE STATES THAT HAVE BEEN TAPPED BY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION'S TASK FORCE TO COMBAT ANTI-SEMITISM OR A FAIR FEAR THAT THEY WILL BE INVESTIGATED SHORTLY.

>> SO WHAT IS THEIR GOAL IN THIS PRIVATE NETWORK?

>> THEIR HOPE IS TO COORDINATE RESPONSES SO THEY DO NOT KIND OF GET PICKED OFF THE WAY THE LAW FIRMS DID.

THERE'S A COUPLE THINGS THEY ARE VERY PROTECTIVE OF THEIR HOPE IS TO BE ABLE TO MAINTAIN INTEGRITY AMONG THOSE SPECIFIC POINTS SO THEY DO NOT NEGOTIATE THEM AWAY ONE AT A TIME.

>> DID YOU LEARN ANYTHING OR IS THIS A RESPONSE TO WHAT HAPPENED AT COLUMBIA?

>> IT IS.

COLUMBIA, AS FAR AS A LOT OF THE SCHOOLS ARE CONCERNED IS A BLUEPRINT FOR NOT TO HANDLE THE SITUATION.

A LOT OF SCHOOLS FEEL THEY HAVE COMPROMISED THEMSELVES BY NEGOTIATING THE TASK FORCE.

IT SHOULD BE NOTED THEY ARE UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE IN COLUMBIA INTERNALLY AND EXTERNALLY.

THEY ARE KIND OF IN A DIFFERENT CATEGORY IN SOME WAYS.

>> WHY DO YOU THINK THERE IS SUCH A DIFFERENT DIRECTION COLUMBIA TOOK FROM WHAT HARVARD IS DOING NOW?

>> FIRST OF ALL THEY WERE FIRST.

ZERO FOR THE PROTESTS IN THE ENCAMPMENTS WERE COLUMBIA.

AND THE INTERNAL CONFLICTS, WITH FACULTY WITH FACULTY, AND PRESTIGE, THAT IS PROBABLY MORE THERE THAN ANYWHERE.

THEY HAD MORE ISSUES TO DEAL WITH.

THERE'S ALSO A SIGNIFICANT OF FOLKS, FACULTY, TRUSTEES, ADMINISTRATIVE BELIEVE THE SCHOOL NEEDS A COURSE CORRECTION IN THAT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IS OFFERING THINGS OR SUGGESTING THEY MOVE ANY DIRECTION THEY WANTED TO GO INTO ANYWAY.

>> WHEN IT COMES TO THE TYPE OF CONTROL THAT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION WANTS TO EXERCISE AND WHAT MIGHT BE HAPPENING AT COLUMBIA OR WHAT MIGHT BE AGREED TO, WHAT IS THE THING THE UNIVERSITIES THAT ARE IN THIS NEW SORT OF CONSORTIUM ARE MOST AFRAID OF?

>> THEY ARE CONCERNED OF GIVING AWAY THEIR INDEPENDENCE.

THEIR ACADEMIC INDEPENDENCE.

WHAT THEY DO NOT WANT IS FOR THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, OR ANYONE ELSE, TO DICTATE WHO THEY HIRE, WHAT THEY RESEARCH, HOW THEY TEACH.

THESE ARE THE REDLINES THAT THEY SORT OF ARE CONGEALING AROUND.

>> THIS WEEK HARVARD RELEASED A REPORT FOLLOWING THEIR INTERNAL PROBE ON HOW THE UNIVERSITY DEALT WITH ANTI-SEMITISM.

WHAT DID THEY FIND?

>> IT WAS A REALLY EXPANSIVE REPORT.

AND SORT OF THE HEADLINE FINDING IS THAT THEY FOUND THERE WAS A LOT OF ANTI- SEMITISM AND THE CULTURE THAT PRODUCED IT.

SO, THEY TOOK THE LONG VIEW, THEY LOOKED AT THE JEWISH COMMUNITY AT HARVARD OVER TIME, THEY LOOKED AT THE BOYCOTT DIVESTED SANCTION MOVEMENT OVER THE PAST 20 YEARS AND HOW THAT INFLUENCED THE CAMPUS.

THEY LOOKED AT THE CURRICULUM, SOME SCHOOLS, THE DIVINITY SCHOOL, THE PUBLIC HEALTH SCHOOL, SOME CLASSES FOUND TO BE OFFERING THE POINT OF VIEW OF THE PALESTINIANS AND NOT THE ISRAELIS, NOT THE ZIONISTS.

THEY FOUND THAT THERE WAS SOME LEVEL OF INDOCTRINATION IN SOME OF THE CLASSES.

>> HAS THERE BEEN A RESPONSE IN THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION TO BE HARVARD REPORT?

>> THEY ARE SAYING THAT HARVARD NEEDS TO HOLD HIMSELF UP TO A HIGHER STANDARD, PROTECT JEWISH STANDARDS.

AND IF THEY ARE THE RECIPIENT OF BILLIONS OF FUNDS, THEY NEED TO MAKE SURE THEY HAVE ALL STUDENTS TREATED WITH RESPECT AND NOT FEEL HARASSED ON CAMPUS.

>> WHEN YOU LOOK AT THESE INSTITUTIONS, THEY HAVE THE ADVANTAGE IN THE MASSIVE ENDOWMENTS, THAT THEY ARE CERTAINLY GOING TO LOSE SIGNIFICANT SUMS OF MONEY IF THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION SAYS IT WILL DO WHAT IT SAYS IT WILL DO AND WITHDRAW SOME OF THE GRANT FUNDING, ET CETERA.

BUT THEY HAVE A WAY TO ABSORB THE SHOCK WAY BETTER THAN PUBLIC UNIVERSITIES, SMALLER COLLEGES, >> THEY HAVE A $53 BILLION ENDOWMENT, IF ANYBODY CAN ENDURE WHAT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IS THREATENING AND MOVING ON, IT IS HARVARD UNIVERSITY.

WHAT HARVARD WOULD SAY IS THAT THERE ENDOWMENT IS ESSENTIALLY SPOKEN FOR.

NOT ALL OF IT BUT HUGE CHUNKS.

WHEN YOU GIVE MONEY TO THE UNIVERSITY, ENDOWING A CHAIR OR SPORTS PROGRAM, THE MONEY IS LEGALLY BOUND IN THAT DIRECTION.

THEY DO HOWEVER HAVE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS AT THEIR DISCRETION THAT THEY USE FOR THE OPERATING BUDGET.

SO THEY HAVE MORE LATITUDE THAN ALMOST ANY OTHER UNIVERSITY IN THE COUNTRY.

>> NOW, WHAT ARE SOME OF THE POINTS OF LEVERAGE THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION STILL HAS LEFT?

I MEAN I HAVE HEARD THAT THE TAX-EXEMPT STATUS FOR EXAMPLE THAT UNIVERSITIES AND NONPROFIT COLLEGES ENJOY, THAT IS ONE THING THEY ARE LOOKING AT.

>> A NUMBER OF THINGS.

THEY HAVE ASKED FOR REPORTS FROM SOMETHING CALLED 117, WHEN A UNIVERSITY GETS $250,000 OR THEY NEED TO FILE PAPERWORK.

ESSENTIALLY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION SAYS THEY DID NOT DO THAT, THEY HAVE NOT DONE IT CORRECTLY.

AS A RESULT THEY ARE OUT OF STEP WITH THE PAPERWORK THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DEMANDS WHEN THEY GET ANY KIND OF RESEARCH GRANT.

THAT PUTS THE GRANTS AT RISK.

ALSO, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY POTENTIALLY TO TURN OFF THE VEIL FOR INTERNATIONAL STUDENTS FROM COMING ON CAMPUS.

AND POTENTIALLY FACULTY.

THERE IS UPWARDS OF 10,000 PEOPLE AT HARVARD THAT COME IN FROM OTHER COUNTRIES THAT THEY PROVIDE A LOT OF MONEY, EVEN MORE IMPORTANTLY, THESE ARE BRILLIANT PEOPLE COMING IN FROM AROUND THE WORLD TO DO RESEARCH AND STUDY, SO IT CUTS HARVARD OFF AT THE KNEES IF THEY ARE TO CUT THAT OFF.

>> WHAT ARE THE RIPPLE EFFECTS HERE?

NOT THAT THEY HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO THOSE THINGS THAT HARVARD YET, BUT EVEN THE THREAT OF POTENTIAL THAT THOSE THINGS CAN HAPPEN?

DOES THAT HAVE A CHILLING RESEARCHERS THAT ARE THINKING ABOUT TAKING A JOB AT HARVARD OR ANOTHER UNIVERSITY THAT MIGHT BE IN THE CROSSHAIRS?

>> THIS AFFECTS THE UNIVERSITY ON EVERY LEVEL.

AS YOU CAN IMAGINE RESEARCH IS TAKING IT ON THE CHIN RIGHT NOW IN A COUPLE OF WAYS.

THERE ARE MAJOR GRANTS THAT ARE IN SOME PLACES GLOBAL OR LINK TO SCHOOLS AROUND THE COUNTRY THAT HAVE BEEN SHUT OFF OR THREATENED TO BE CLOSED.

SO CAREERS ARE AT STAKE IN TERMS OF THE RESURGENCE AND HOW THEY CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD IF THAT MONEY DOES NOT HAPPEN.

SOME OF THEM WILL TRY TO MOVE TO DIFFERENT UNIVERSITIES, POTENTIALLY DIFFERENT COUNTRIES.

ONE OF THE MORE LONG-STANDING POTENTIAL IMPACTS COULD BE THE GRAD STUDENTS.

THESE GRANTS FUND RESEARCH, AND THAT MONEY IS USED TIRE PHD'S, POST GRADS THAT DO A LOT OF THE WORK IN THE LABORATORIES.

IF THEY DO NOT HAVE MONEY TO PAY FOR THEM THEN THEY CANNOT ENTER INTO THE RESEARCH AND EVENTUALLY SQUELCHING THEIR CAREER IN THE U.S. BEFORE THEY >> I SAW --INVITING SCIENTISTS TO COME OVER TO EUROPEAN UNIVERSITIES AND COUNTRIES.

IS IT TOO EARLY TO SEE ANY ACTIVE POACHING GOING ON?

>> THE ATTEMPTS ARE HAPPENING AND WE WILL BEGIN TO SEE THINGS LIKE THIS AROUND THE COUNTRY.

A COUPLE OF OTHERS HAVE SUGGESTED THEY ARE GOING IN A COUPLE HAVE.

IT IS NOT SUCH A SMALL THING TO PULL UP A RESEARCH LAB INVENTORY.

IT TAKES YEARS, IT IS A TREMENDOUS INVESTMENT IN TIME AND BRAINPOWER TO GET THESE THINGS, IT WOULD BE MUCH MORE EFFICACIOUS FOR THE UNIVERSITIES AND RESEARCHERS AT THIS GETS NEGOTIATED TO SOME KIND OF COMPROMISE.

>> YOU KIND OF POINTED OUT IN THIS ARTICLE TOO THAT THIS ISSUE OF THE WHITE HOUSE VERSUS HARVARD BE COMING TO A HEAD NOW BUT IS A LONG TIME MAKING.

EXPLAIN.

>> THE REASON THIS IS SUCH AN INTERESTING ISSUE, SUCH A POLITICALLY POWERFUL ISSUE FOR TRUMP, BECAUSE THE UNIVERSITIES HAVE LOST PUBLIC SUPPORT OVER THE PAST 15 YEARS.

FAITH IN HIGHER EDUCATION PLUMMETED BY SOMETHING LIKE 25 POINTS ACCORDING TO GALA, BETWEEN 2015 AND 2023.

LOT OF THINGS, BECAUSE THE UNIVERSITIES HAVE LOST THE PUBLIC, THERE IS ANGER TOWARD THEM, FRUSTRATION, FOLKS FEEL LIKE THERE IS A CONTRACT THAT UNIVERSITIES, AN IMPLICIT CONTRACT THAT UNIVERSITIES HAVE WITH THE PUBLIC IN EXCHANGE FOR SIGNIFICANT FUNDING AND FREEDOM.

THEY NEED TO GRADUATE STUDENTS THAT ARE BOTH APPEARED FOR THE LABOR MARKET AND PREPARED TO BE GOOD CITIZENS.

AND THERE IS A LARGE SWATH OF THIS COUNTRY THAT LEAVE THEY HAVE FAILED ON BOTH OF THOSE ACCOUNTS.

THEY ARE ANGRY ABOUT IT AND THEY WANT TO SEE THEM PUNISHED.

BETWEEN WHERE THIS GROUP OF UNIVERSITIES WANT TO GET TO?

WHETHER THEY THINK THEY HAVE ANY KIND OF NEGOTIATING POWER OR LEVERAGE, OR ABILITY TO TALK TO THE ADMINISTRATION.

>> THERE IS CURRENTLY A COURT CASE HAPPENING --TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IN THE FEDERAL COURT OF BOSTON.

THAT WILL PLAY OUT OVER TIME.

THE NEGOTIATIONS ARE HAPPENING BETWEEN UNIVERSITIES.

THESE UNIVERSITIES ARE MAJOR EMPLOYERS SO CONGRESSPEOPLE, SENATORS, GOVERNORS, BUSINESS LEADERS ARE ALL INVESTED IN SOME KIND OF SETTLEMENT, SOME KIND OF WAY FORWARD.

THE ENTIRE ECONOMY OF MASSACHUSETTS, TO SOME EXTENT, IS CONTINGENT ON THE SUCCESS OF HARVARD.

YOU CAN MULTIPLY THAT BY PRETTY MUCH EVERY MAJOR CONSTITUTION IN THE CITY, IN THE STATE RATHER.

SO THE STAKES ARE ENORMOUS.

THE STAKES FOR THE AMERICAN RESEARCH THAT COMES OUT OF THE UNIVERSITIES IS THE FOUNDATION FOR A LOT OF THE BUSINESSES THAT POWER OUR ECONOMY AND KEEP THE COUNTRY, YOU KNOW THE HEGEMON THAT WE ARE.

THERE IS A LOT AT PLAY.

>> IS THERE A SENSE THAT THESE UNIVERSITIES AT THIS IS A BLIP?

THIS IS SOMETHING THEY CAN WEATHER, THEY CAN NEGOTIATE THROUGH?

OR THAT THIS IS A WATERSHED MOMENT THAT THERE WILL BE A BEFORE AND AFTER WHERE THEY WILL HAVE TO STRUCTURALLY AND TACTICALLY THINK DIFFERENTLY?

>> I DO NOT KNOW ANYBODY THAT DOES NOT THINK THAT THIS IS NOT A WATERSHED MOMENT.

THERE HAS BEEN SOME PUSHBACK FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN REGARDS TO ISSUES AROUND TITLE IX.

BUT IT DID NOT GO TO THIS EXTREME.

THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN UNIVERSITIES, RESEARCH UNIVERSITIES, AND THE GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN SO TIGHT BEFORE, SO MANY GENERATIONS, THAT THE SHOT THAT TRUMP IS CALLING NOW IS FROM A PLAYBOOK THAT HAD NOT BEEN WRITTEN BEFORE.

>> YOU KNOW WHEN YOU THINK ACADEMIA BRINGS, NOT JUST TO COLLEGE STUDENTS, BUT REALLY WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT INNOVATION, THE ECONOMY, AND FUTURE JOBS, RIGHT?

WHETHER SOMEBODY DECIDES TO COME UP WITH AN IDEA HERE VERSUS IN EUROPE SOMEWHERE, WHAT THE EFFECTS OF THAT ARE.

IS THERE ANYBODY TRYING TO COMPROMISE QUANTIFY WHAT UNIVERSITIES ARE DOING TODAY AND ABROAD TO THE ECONOMY.

AND IF THIS STRUCTURAL CHANGE HAPPENS, WHAT THE CONSEQUENCES MIGHT BE.

>> UNIVERSITIES ARE MAYBE THE EIGHTH LARGEST EXPORT BUSINESS IN THE COUNTRY.

IS A FUNNY WAY TO THINK ABOUT IT.

THERE IS A 1.1 MILLION STUDENTS OVERSEAS THAT STUDY AT AMERICAN UNIVERSITIES.

THEY BRING THEIR DOLLARS INTO THIS COUNTRY, ABOUT $48 BILLION.

I THINK WE SPEND AROUND, WE GET ABOUT 120 BILLION FOR FUEL AND GAS.

IT IS A HUGE EXPORT INDUSTRY.

THAT ALONE IS ENOUGH TO PUT A SIGNIFICANT DENT IN THE ECONOMIES OF THESE UNIVERSITIES.

ADDING ON THAT, THE RESEARCH.

IF YOU LOOK AT YOUR iPHONE, THERE IS HUNDREDS OF PATENTS THAT WERE DEVELOPED AT UNIVERSITIES.

IT IS QUIETLY DONE.

EVERYONE KNOWS WHAT STEVE JOBS DID.

HE ASSEMBLED THE COLLECTIVE BRAINPOWER ASSEMBLED AT THESE UNIVERSITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

SO YOU CAN MAKE A PRETTY STRONG CASE, THE iPHONE THAT WE ARE HOLDING, THE INTERNET WE ARE SPEAKING ON, UNLESS THESE UNIVERSITIES HAD DONE THE RESEARCH THAT IS NOW BEING THREATENED.

>> ARE THE PRESIDENTS AND THE BOARDS CONCERNED ABOUT BRAND DAMAGE?

AND HOW FUTURE CLASSES OF APPLICANTS OR STUDENTS OR PROFESSORS OR RESEARCH ASSISTANTS ARE GOING TO MEASURE THEM?

IN WHAT SEEMS LIKE A POLITICALLY UNWINNABLE SITUATION.

>> THERE IS A REASON THIS TASK FORCE EXISTS, WITH REGARD TO SEMITISM ON CAMPUS.

IN THE REPORT YESTERDAY FOUND SIGNIFICANT ANTI-SEMITISM, AND WITH ISLAMOPHOBIA THEY RELEASED TWO REPORTS.

BEHIND THAT WAS A DECLINE IN STANDARDS OF CURRICULUM AND TEACHING.

WHICH IS VERY DAMAGING TO HARVARD'S BRAND.

THIS IS THE GREATEST INSTITUTION OF THE WESTERN CIVILIZATION, IF YOU ASK FOLKS AT HARVARD YARD.

SO THEY ARE COMPROMISED AT THE INTEGRITY OF THEIR TEACHING.

THEN THERE BRAND IS ABSOLUTELY TARNISHED AS A RESULT.

SO, THAT IS HALF OF IT.

>> WHAT IS THE OTHER HALF?

>> IF THE UNIVERSITIES ARE SEEN BUYING FOLKS ON THE LEFT AS COMPROMISING TOO QUICKLY OR EASILY, THEY WILL CONSIDER THESE UNIVERSITIES TO BE SELLOUTS.

THEY WILL SAY YOU KNOW YOU HAVE THIS TREMENDOUS WEALTH AND PRIVILEGE AND POWER AND IF YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO LEVERAGE IT, STICK YOUR NEXT OUT, COLLECTIVELY, AGAINST WHAT A LOT OF FOLKS WOULD CONSIDER A CREEPING FASCISM, IT WILL DAMAGE THE BRAND FROM THE OTHER DIRECTION.

>> DOUG, THANKS SO MUCH.

>> THANK YOU FOR INVITING ME ON.

>>> IN UKRAINE THEY ARE TAUGHT TO SAVE LIVES AND WORK IN THE MOST DANGEROUS CONFLICT ZONES.

BUT NOT UNTIL THEY HAVE BEEN THROUGH RIGOROUS TRAINING.

ISABEL ROSALES TAKES A LOOK INSIDE THE CANINE TRAINING CENTER IN BOSNIA THAT IS PREPARING SOME REMARKABLE DOGS FOR THE UKRAINIAN FRONT LINES.

HERE IS THE REPORT.

SIT.

STAY.

SEARCH.

>> Reporter: AT THIS BOSNIAN FACILITY A DOGS TRAINING CAN MEAN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIFE AND DEATH.

TAIL WAGGING AS SHE SPRINGS FOR A RED BALL, MAY IS NOT JUST LEARNING TO FETCH, SHE IS LEARNING TO SNIFF OUT LANDMINES.

>> SINCE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF THE CENTER, MORE THAN 500 MINING DOGS AND HUNDREDS OF DOGS FOR OTHER PURPOSES HAVE BEEN TRAINED.

>> Reporter: ONCE A SERIOUS TRAINING CENTER, SENDING DOGS TO CONFLICT ZONES AROUND THE WORLD.

CAMBODIA, ZIMBABWE, IRAQ, AND NOW UKRAINE.

LANDMINES AND UNEXPLODED ORDINANCE LITTERED UKRAINIAN LAND.

AFTER MORE THAN THREE YEARS OF WAR, THE COUNTRY HAS THE MOST MINDS IN THE WORLD.

THE U.N. SAYS.

IT IS A DEADLY MESS.

ALSO A BLOW TO EXPORTS.

AS DETONATING IN AGRICULTURAL FIELDS KEEP FARMERS AWAY.

SENT TO SOME OF THE MOST BATTLED REGIONS OF UKRAINE SO FAR.

AND MORE WILL VEST UP.

>> WE HAVE THIS EXPRESSION, THIS PARALLEL, WHICH SAYS ONE MINE FOUND, ONE FAMILY SAVED.

>> Reporter: IT ALLSTATE 'S HERE.

PAUSE SCURRYING, TAILS WAGGING, HE WAS IN THE MAKING.

>> THE DOGS WILL BE INCREDIBLY USEFUL DURING THAT TERRIBLE WAR.

THAT TOOK UP SO MUCH OF THE 1990s.

>>> FINALLY, A DAY TO CELEBRATE THE BEST AND BRIGHTEST ON BROADWAY.

THE NOMINATIONS FOR THIS YEAR'S TONY AWARDS HAVE BEEN ANNOUNCED.

AMONG THOSE LEADING THE CHARGE ARE DEATH BECOMES HER, MAYBE HAPPY ENDING, AND BUENA VISTA SOCIAL CLUB.

AND NONCE TO PLACE WHO CAST AND CREW HAVE BEEN ON OUR SHOW, EUREKA DAY, OUR TOWN, AND OPERATION MINCEMEAT.

CONGRATS TO THEM.

AND ON TOP OF THAT RECOGNITION FOR GOOD NIGHT AND GOOD LUCK, BASED ON THE 2005 FILM OF THE SAME NAME.

THE TIMELY PLAY IS ABOUT TRUTH IN A TIME OF CREEPING AUTHORITARIANISM.

GEORGE CLOONEY PLEASE OUR PATRON SAINT OF BROADCAST JOURNALISM, EDWARD R. MURROW.

HE HAS WON AND NOMINATION FOR HIS PERFORMANCE.

THAT IS IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.

IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT IS COMING UP, SIGN-UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING, AND GOODBYE FROM LONDON.